Rick Hahn can’t infringe on your constitutional right to speculate about Pedro Grifol
When Rick Hahn singled out, but didn’t identify, a national reporter that he wasn’t happy with due to speculation about Pedro Grifol’s job security, I assumed it was Bob Nightengale, given that he pointed out Grifol’s lack of impact with the White Sox on 670 The Score last week.
But no, it was Jon Heyman, who told the Mully & Haugh show on Monday that Grifol “could be one-and-done” if the White Sox don’t turn it around.
Hahn didn’t appreciate the heat, and tried to frame it as out-of-town stupid to the local beat writers before Monday’s game.
“What happened this morning is there apparently was a very well-respected national out-of-town reporter (Heyman) speculating about Pedro’s job security on a local sports station. “You guys who are here day in and day out, especially the beat group that spends the amount of time talking to me or talking to others around the front office and hearing how we operate, have heard me say before that this underperformance that we’ve had so far or any of the issues that we’ve had thus far in this season, it was not on Pedro and on the coaching staff. I don’t think we could’ve been more clear about that. I understand that people, especially in this day and age … where clicks matter and ratings matter and palace intrigue matters – and I’m not going to be able to solve that here in my position, nor is it my responsibility to solve that – but as we get closer to the deadline, as we get closer toward the end of the season and people want to speculate on what’s going to happen around here and what’s not going to happen, I would caution against putting too much credibility into reports that don’t come from people who are here all the time.
And I don’t mean to criticize or single out any national guy in particular – many of them are very, very good – (but) I actually called the reporter today that made the report and asked him what he was basing it on and we had a great talk and he shared that that was he was simply answering that question with his own speculation and not something that he was reporting. I continue to have a great respect for him.
It sure sounded like an overreaction to the radio spot in question. Mike Mulligan was the one who entered the phrase “one-and-done” into the record as he asked Heyman about Grifol’s surprisingly snippy response to questions about the batting order, and Heyman acknowledged the possibility. I suppose it’s sort of fitting that Hahn responded to a discussion about disproportionate frustration with some of his own.
The issue is that each side is discussing Grifol’s job security in their own context. If you think Hahn is the one who will get to decide whether Grifol will stick around for 2024 — and I’m guessing Hahn thinks that’s the case — then sure, any speculation is purely unfounded. Hahn couldn’t have been more effusive about Grifol during his introduction, and he can’t pretend it never happened.
If you think that Hahn won’t or shouldn’t be the guy determining Grifol’s future, then sure, why couldn’t Grifol be one-and-done? What has he done to distinguish himself from any managerial candidate a new GM would favor? Josh and I actually discussed that latter question just the other day:
SOX MACHINE PODCAST: Honeymoon period is over for Pedro Grifol
Hahn, of course, won’t indulge that second scenario. And while he might feel obligated to set and reset the agenda for White Sox conversation, there’s a risk to mentioning it at all, because he Streisand-Effected me into learning what Heyman said in the first place. Heyman doesn’t strike me as a go-to guy for what the White Sox might be thinking, so I don’t go out of my way to absorb what he says. Now here I am, listening to his spot and talking about it.
It’s similar to the when the White Sox issued a strongly, clumsily worded statement shooting down a Jerry Reinsdorf anecdote from David Samson that I would’ve been inclined to give only a grain of truth considering the source, only for Reinsdorf himself to eventually say in a public forum that, yes, having a chance to contend in the last month of the season is usually good enough. When it feels like White Sox personnel doth protest too much, there’s a reason to trust yourthinks.
In the meantime, Nightengale — a national reporter whose White Sox information I pay attention to, even if it requires heavy machinery to discard the framing — said in his Sunday column that some White Sox wouldn’t mind Hahn putting them on the block.
Several veterans in the Chicago White Sox organization have privately expressed that they would welcome a trade, and considering the way they are playing, may soon get their wish.
None of the players, however, have formally asked the White Sox front office to trade them.
When Nightengale spent his White Sox spring training preview defending Tony La Russa’s honor, he extensively quoted Joe Kelly and Lance Lynn. Disclaimer: This is my own speculation.
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The thought crossed my mind that Jerry muttered something about Hahn’s job security that got to Heyman. If the person in charge in October looks back on a losing season by a manager hired by the last guy, Grifol could very well be one and done.
That wouldn’t be a fault of the reporter. But the scenario assumes Jerry 1) was talking to Heyman, and 2) actually is entertaining getting a new head of baseball operations.
One can dream.
Lynn should stop being ass if he wants the Sox to trade him. Sunday helped.
My prediction is the Sox sell at the deadline, but an easy schedule second half, the desire of the remaining players to perform, and the Central being bad has them contending in September.
I sure hope they are sellers. I see zero point in getting nothing for all the players leaving the next two years.
Even if their 2nd half is easier, their schedule through the July trade deadline isn’t. After Texas they have Boson and the Angels. Should be bunch of losses. 3 vs the A’s, ok, they should win 2 or 3. After that, Jays and Cardinals to close out the first half. Cards record is bad, but they are still better than the Sox. 2nd half starts out with the Braves, Mets, Twins, Cubs, and Guardians through end of July. Braves should crush them, Mets should win, Cubs are a better team. Twins and Guardians aren’t good and can be beat, but there is no reason to expect the Sox to win more than they lose against them. Other than the A’s, I don’t see a lot of wins from now until the trade deadline. Which makes selling pretty damn likely.
My fear is not that they will be sellers (they should be), it is that Hahn sells the wrong players.
Are there wrong players to sell?
There are certainly wrong players to buy.
Anybody leaving, at the end of this year especially but next year as well, seem like good candidates. I don’t think he will trade Cease, Robert, or Kopech. I doubt anybody other than Gio, Lynn, Grandal, Kelly, TA, or Graveman will get dealt.
Unless the Sox can play themselves there’s no easy schedule for this team.
I don’t think they have much to sell or buy with…I think the team stays pretty much the same.
Pitching is going to be in high demand. Giolito and Cease would generate a lot of interest, and even Lynn might have a taker for teams running thin on depth. Position side, I could see teams kicking the tires on Grandal, but the return wouldn’t be significant. After him, Robert’s probably the only guy contending teams look at that might provide a significant boost, and I’m assuming they aren’t interested in trading him yet.
Giolito is the one trade I think that is realistic and could bring back something valuable.
It just seems odd to call out Heyman when Nightengale was on the same show the week before basically saying that Grifol hasn’t done his job with 0 response from the org.
It what this organization specializes in..Weird and boring
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. I don’t want them to sell. I want them to whither and die on this goddamn vine.
With that said, if Lynn or Kelly are wanting out and bad for the clubhouse, trade them. Just keep Gio to go down with the ship.
If there’s no chance at competing until a new regime comes in, give it your best to win this putrid division this year.
I still agree with this. If they turn it around and get close to .500 and somehow win the division, then at least we get to see playoff baseball. I don’t want Hahn making any big trades because he will get taken by a good GM. Don’t let Hahn anywhere near a rebuild, or even a semi-rebuild. Just lose 90-95 games with this roster that Hahn said would win multiple championships. If that happens, I think even Jerry will be forced to make some significant changes. They have the biggest drop in attendance from last year in all of baseball. Jerry has to notice that.
I used to think like you, but then it came to me that if the White Sox don’t sell, we will have Burger/Eloy/Tim/Vaughn/Sheets/Moncada next year, and I can’t take it anymore. Not another year with this Hahny bunch again. Hahn needs to sell.
Aren’t the players you want to trade the same ones other teams don’t want? I think Giolito and Graveman are the most likely trade candidates because other teams will want them.
Grandal? Kelly? Maybe Lynn if he has now learned to be “crafty.”
But if Hahn sells, then we just get a bunch of less talented Hahny players. That’s even worse than what we have now. Hahn doesn’t need to sell, Hahn needs to be sold.
My head agrees with you but my heart says, “who cares? I’m tired of these players and this team and I’d rather look to the future.”
Unfortunately with Hahn at the helm and JR as the owner, there is no future. Make them keep going for it. They’ll probably fail, but they’ll have eat it each time. If they sneak in because we play in the most incompetent division in baseball history, I’ll gladly take October baseball no matter how depressing the ending will likely be.
As a fan of good things being rewarded, I can’t abide these dipshits in the playoffs.
I wanna learn more of this Streisand-Effected thing that I have never heard before.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect
I think he got you.
i thought we were done with the whoshtrap
Hahn is just so bad at his job. He gets angry at the criticism of Grifol because he knows that Grifol was his hand-picked choice, and if he says something bad about him, it won’t make Hahn look good. So he would rather continue with a manager who we can all see is in over his head. Any good GM would say, “yeah, I made a mistake”, and move on. But Hahn is so insecure that he has to try to convince us that it’s not Pedro’s fault, but the players. Well, who acquired all these players? Yes, Mr. Hahn, that would be you. Any semi-functional organization would have moved on from Hahn years ago. But of course this is Jerry’s team, so they would have to improve by leaps and bounds just to get to semi-functional. It has just all become so pointless to get wrapped up in this team. I am becoming more and more disinterested with every lame quote Hahn gives. Just fire him already, Jerry. Getz can’t be any worse.
I don’t know where he was reported on (and it was probably recapped here), but Jerry, Nightengale, George Brett, I think La Russa, and some other baseball guys routinely share meals in Arizona. Kinda explains Nightingale’s access and why he’s still talking about La Russa as the world has moved on. Imagine a local beat having that kind of access with the owner.
All the while Hahn is using the unjust firing of Fegan to shield himself from tough questions.
So Rick Hahn said words again huh? Just supporting Sox Machine.
This is great news. Now, do I still have to fight for my right to par-tay?
My biggest wish, from a sports perspective, is that everyone associated with the White Sox from Reinsdorf on down, be replaced prior to next season. I want completely different names and faces.
With TLR it was easy to spot the problem right from jump, he didn’t have his team ready to play everyday.
With Grifol the problem is just as easy to spot. He doesn’t learn. He keeps making the same mistakes. They canned Ricky because he wouldn’t deviate from his pitching schedule. Grifol is actually worse, because not only will he not deviate from his set ideas, it doesn’t appear he has the respect of the players that Ricky had.
You can’t go to a loser organization and expect to pluck winning managers.
They didn’t fire Ricky for any reason other than they thought they were gonna land A.J. Hinch. Guy went into the playoffs with one viable starting pitcher and still almost pulled off a series win.
I disagree with the idea that you can’t expect to hire good managers or coaches from losing organizations. That same logic would apply to players. “Teams lose because they have bad players, therefore don’t acquire players from bad teams. Mike Trout lacks TWTW. He’s been to the playoffs fewer times than Moncada. And the Angels went 0-3 the single time they went. If the Angels ask about the Sox taking him off their hands, the Sox should run away.”
You can find a good manager almost anywhere, even Kansas City.
All that said, I’m not impressed with Grifol so far.
How much of Moncada’s salary would the Sox have to eat in order to move him? That’s where to start.
They just finished eating Dallas Keuchel’s contract last year. I think they’re still full and don’t want anything else to eat.
Let’s not forget Leury, Ruiz, and Diekman. Heck, they paid Pollock $5 million to play elsewhere because he was willing to take a pay cut just to get out of here.
Baseball Trade Values estimates $12.1MM.
He’s owed about $9 million for the remainder of this season and $24 million next season. I don’t think any team would want him for anywhere near $21 million. Even if they wait until the offseason, I don’t think anybody would even want him for $12 million. If he were a free agent right now he’d get maybe a $4-7 million make-good contract with incentives, and the White Sox would probably be the ones offering it.
Is this typical of how an MLB GM spends their time?
No wonder the Sox are so fucking terrible.
Wasn’t he spotted sitting by himself in a coffee shop on the day of last year’s trade deadline? I don’t have a source, but I remember hearing something like that.
He just didn’t want to be the only one in the room getting roasted.
The two things I need to know about Pedro Grifol (other than that he doesn’t use the internet):
(1) While I understand that orgs sometimes feel that they need to go outside to find a manager, I also think it tells us something that KC, who knew Grifol, chose to hire a different first-time manager.
(2) The timing of the interview, Quertaro announcement in KC, and Grifol announcement always caused me to wonder whether the Sox job was Grifol’s second choice.
So, he got his first managing job but it wasn’t the job he wanted because the org he wanted to work for- who knew him – didn’t think he was the best first time manager for the job.
Reportedly Piccolo was given a directive to go outside their organization for a new manager. Grifol never had a chance at that job. I don’t think he’s any good, but not getting the KC job doesn’t factor into it for me.
Yeah, I hear you. But then just remember: he blew the Sox away. If he had blown KC away in the several years he worked there then they would have hired him rather than going outside the org, right?