White Sox 2, Padres 1: Winning season still in play

Bullet-point recap:

*Lance Lynn ended his season on a high note, throwing seven innings of one-run ball and tilting a couple of season stats in his favor. He picked up the win to finish the season over .500 (8-7), and he lowered his ERA to 3.99.

*The only damage Lynn absorbed was a solo shot by Ha-Seong Kim in the bottom of the seventh, which came shortly after the Padres clinched a postseason berth because Milwaukee lost.

*Fortunately, Kim’s homer only answered for Elvis Andrus’ solo shot off Blake Snell in the top of the six. The Padres had no answer to Adam Engel’s broken-bat flare to center that scored Andrew Vaughn from second with two outs in the top of the seventh. It was the Sox’s only hit with runners in scoring position in six at-bats.

*Andrus has eight homers since playing his first game with the White Sox on Aug. 19. Eloy Jiménez is the only other White Sox with more (10), while AJ Pollock is the only one tying him.

*The Padres went 0-for-6 with RISP, squandering their best opportunity in the eighth. Reynaldo López opened the inning by giving up two singles over three batters that put runners on the corners for the heart of the lineup. Manny Machado popped out and Jake Cronenworth flied out to end the threat.

*Liam Hendriks also had to deal with two baserunners in the bottom of the ninth, but both reached after two outs, and he killed the threat with a routine grounder to short by Jorge Alfaro.

Record: 79-80 | Box score | Statcast

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Jim Margalus
Jim Margalus

Writing about the White Sox for a 16th season, first here, then at South Side Sox, and now here again. Let’s talk curling.

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charlie

Stating the obvious:
Andrus must be brought back

steelydan52

Agreed on Andrus. We could almost have predicted the Sox winning against the Padres only because we didn’t think they would and frankly, I hope they sweep the Twins to wrap up the season. I know we gain nothing as fans except to go into the off season with the wins. With TLR retiring we get part of our wish but only part of our wish.

charlie

He’s our best player outside of Cease at the moment and I don’t think anyone else is close.

a-t

as 2B for a reasonable rate sure

charlie

I’d play him at 3B even though our albatross isn’t likely able to be moved

a-t

i have to applaud your dedication for turning everything into anti-Moncada bs lol

even with as brutal a year as he’s had, yoan’s 1.0 fWAR in 416 PA is considerably less bad than the collective -0.2 fWAR over 865 PA the Sox have gotten from 2B this year lol

charlie

The goal is to win right?
How anyone can continue to defend the least clutch player on the team is beyond me

a-t

moncada hitting 2022, overall: .216/.280/.361, 81 wRC+

moncada hitting 2022, runner(s) on: .273/.356/.461, 132 wRC+

moncada hitting 2022, RISP: .281/.369/.531, 151 wRC+

TL;DR: statistically speaking, shove it

charlie

Not one hit or RBI in mid to late innings ALL YEAR when we’ve been behind

Joliet Orange Sox

Andrus has played great for the Sox and hit well over the 178 PA he’s had with the Sox. I kinda hope the Sox remember Andrus is 34 years old and had over 8000 PA before joining the Sox and he has a career OPS+ of 86 before they make him a cornerstone of the future. There’s at least some chance the 8000 PA’s of poor hitting are more representative of his true hitting level than the recent 178 PA of good hitting.

charlie

I have to imagine he’d take a 1 year deal

dwjm3

I’ll pass

Right Size Wrong Shape

I tend to lean that way too. I like Andrus and he has played really well for the Sox, but anyone who thinks he is going to play like that for a full season is thinking wishfully. I wouldn’t be mad if they brought him back to play 2B or as a utility guy, but I wouldn’t pay him too much. The farm system isn’t great, but the one area where they have depth is middle infield, and I think they could replicate his production with those players. Of course, I’d love for them to go out and acquire a big name 2B, but I don’t see that happening.

PauliePaulie

You think the Sox, the Chicago White Sox, have fixed him, turning back the clock to 2017?
And another RHH, with a career .686 OPS vs RHP, and still isn’t doing a great job getting on base, (.316 White Sox OBP) is wise use of a roster spot?
BTW- That 3B you dislike so much has has a higher WRC+ than Andrus, since Elvis was signed.

Last edited 2 months ago by PauliePaulie
charlie

Per my last reply to a-t:
Don’t tell me what you hit
(which is still shit) tell me when you hit it

PauliePaulie

So because Andrus hit for 4 weeks, you’re going to ignore the last 4 1/2 years.

charlie

The guy’s a ballplayer.
That’s not going to change.

Trooper Galactus

Andrus has several years of being a decidedly mediocre option and he’s an up-the-middle defender entering his mid-30s. If that’s the extent of the White Sox fixing what’s wrong with their roster, then just write off 2023 right now also.

a-t

Fine, you want late game sitch? Great!

Moncada, 2022, runner(s) on base, 6th+ inning: .299/.422/.478, 155 wRC+

Moncada, 2022, 6th+ inning, RISP: .325/.451/.550., 178 wRC+

He’s been outright destroying the ball in the situations you describe. TL;DR: Statistically speaking, shove it, again

Last edited 2 months ago by a-t
charlie

You’re conveniently ignoring the ‘when we’re behind’ part.
And does it please you to
‘statistically speaking’ make it personal?

a-t

Well now we’re getting into absolutely tiny sample sizes! And you’re still full of BS. RISP, 6th+ inning, high leverage (tied or close behind): in all of 20 PA, .313/.400/.500, 153 wRC+. 8 RBI too, if that’s what you want.

charlie

Well Mr ‘BS’ I see you’re still unwilling to speak to the ‘when we’re behind’ part because there’s nothing you can reference! If you want him at bat in a clutch situation when we’re behind you’re not my kind of baseball man.

BenwithVen

6th+ inning, high leverage (tied or close behind): in all of 20 PA, .313/.400/.500, 153 wRC+. 8 RBI too, if that’s what you want.

charlie

Sorry, don’t buy it.
I watch the games and however many times he’s come up mid innings on WHEN WE’VE BEEN BEHIND he hasn’t come through with a hit or RBI once.

texag10

I applaud you’re ability to comment on the internet without the ability to read. Technology really has come a long way.

ForsterFTOG

Fairly harsh but well deserved.

charlie

I see you’re much more interested in blasting me than acknowledging the larger point of how much the guy sucks. The longer he remains our 3B the longer we will go without winning.

BillyKochFanClub

He was incredibly disappointing in ‘22, but that is the extent of the suckage in his career. A bounce back in ‘23 season isn’t out of the question. If we get ‘21 Moncada back, 3b is in good hands. If he stays on this path, we’ve got a big problem. However his future contributions are still a question mark, not a forgone conclusion which is what you’re making it out to be.

Last edited 2 months ago by BillyKochFanClub
charlie

He’s sucked for far too long Billy. I just wish people would finally stop making excuses for him.

texag10

A little piece of life advice you’ve apparently never learned, no one will ever debate topics with you if you cover your ears and go “la la la can’t hear you” when presented with evidence that clearly proves your position is wrong.

charlie

Looks like you’re covering yours by refusing to acknowledge he’s hurting us far more than helping

jorgefabregas

Come back, charlie! Wanna see if you continue dismissing all available evidence.

charlie

I stand corrected.
Not much there for an entire season though and nothing when we’ve been behind for two months.

snoopy369

That’s amazing… MLB really gets digital things right for the most part. Can’t imagine the NFL putting this sort of thing together.

jorgefabregas

I think Jim put it together. They let you put together your own reel, I believe.

Torpedo Jones

No need to feed the troll here. I love a reactionary, anecdotal hot take as much as the next guy, but “charlie” is either arguing in bad faith or is beyond hope.

There’s plenty you can say about Moncada – he’s not playing to his potential and we really need him to do better. But the meatball mentality of “dat guy NEVER does good when it counts!” isn’t worth engaging.

charlie

How about he’s been killing us for far too long Torpedo. Is that in bad faith?

Torpedo Jones

I’m open to hearing your argument, provided you can provide some actual data. As I noted above, he’s not playing to his potential. But I think the notion that he’s what’s “killing” the White Sox seems a bit dramatic. This team has many problems.

Did you have any data you wanted to share about the specific ways he’s “killing” the team, in your opinion?

charlie

The batting average speaks for itself (helped significantly by I believe a 4 and 5 hit game in blowouts) along with overwhelmingly larger evidence to the contrary of Jim’s sample over the course of the entire season and especially over the past two plus months of not coming through when we’re down.

Joliet Orange Sox

I have read the posts in these comments. I have watched Jim’s video compilation. Much like the Kurosawa film Rashômon, this experience has made me contemplate the nature of truth.

Foulkelore

After reading it, you are contemplating something related to Kurosawa, while I’m contemplating something related to Harakiri.

charlie

Pretty sure you’d be one of the last people Keith would approve his name being linked to.

Holland23

After reading all the messages above, I think you should stick to your expertise: pinch running.

charlie

Ha!

texag10

For comparison’s sake:
Jose Abreu is .250/.455/.375, 137 wRC+, and 7 RBI in 22 PAs.
Eloy is at .417/.500/.583, 214 wRC+, and 5 RBIs in 14 PAs but more interestingly, he never struck out.

Trooper Galactus

NO

dongutteridge

Pretty sure the 2023 second baseman is one of:

Romy Gonzalez
Lenny Sosa
Jose Rodriguez
Yolbert Sanchez
Josh Harrison

upnorthsox

Why? I’m sure/hope there is competition for 2nd base next year but why that list?

texag10

Because the free agent market sucks, we aren’t going to outbid the market for Trea Turner to turn him into a 2B, we already have a high payroll with needs elsewhere, and all those guys are already on the team. There is the chance that Mendick will be recovered enough to compete for the job. The timeline these days seems to be about 6-9 months so he could be ready to go for spring training.

chambers.kevin

Bring Andrus back on a 1 or 2 year deal and trade Anderson. Andrus, brings flair, attitude, knowledge, personality to this team, and has helped the pitching staff in ways Anderson never will. Just by saying a word or two to help them calm down. Tim Anderson is overrated, with mediocre defense, and definitely seems to have an attitude problem. He’s doesn’t have the personality to be The guy, but rather A guy.

a-t

TA is a throughly better player on the field than Andrus is. Andrus has only cracked the 4 fWAR mark twice in his 14 seasons, while TA has done so twice in the last four years; one of those, 2020, he was well on his way to it if the season hadn’t been so short, and this year he’s just been out with injury.

You can have all the intangible qualities that you like in Andrus just fine if he plays at 2B. Replacing a star SS on a cheap contract with a guy that will be 35 having a 6 week revival is incredibly silly.

charlie

A guy who swears by stats chooses to minimize the most recent ones which are exceptional…meshed with a feel for the game beyond compare.

Alfornia Jones

It’s less about replacing TA, and more about using his dollars elsewhere. However, he is a career .315 OBP hitting lead-off, Elvis confirmed how easy it was to replace him. TA is what he is: no on base skills other than his contact (June and July showed this won’t age well) and league avg defense to below avg defense. He doesn’t steal bases anymore, and this year was a drought for XBH and homers.

He has market value, one of the few players on the team you could get fair market value. Two years left on his deal at below market rate. If the Dodgers don’t resign Turner, then he is perfect for them. TA can be a complementary player on a stocked roster. He’s not a leader, he won’t be missed.

Use his money to go get real corner outfielders. Going into 2023 with real LF and RF is minimum required. The Sox system has done well developing middle infielders the last few years, bring a veteran in to start off and turn it over to one of Sosa/Gonzalez/Rodriguez for 1-2 years before Montgomery is ready. Real baseball people will see this if we are lucky enough to get one. Kenny might even be sharp enough to get this.

a-t

Counterpoints: 1) His cost of $12.5M is significantly below his market value. Why do you think you could get two starting quality position players, one of em a SS, with that money— let alone the Sox FO? For 2022 they spent about that sum on Kelly and Leury, and will spend that sum on Pollock. Who, even if he regains his Dodgers form, is still not as good as TA. It’s a peanuts amount for a star shortstop, that’s the most excess value the Sox have. As such, trading him this offseason is tantamount to throwing in the towel for 2023.

2) XBH, HR, and SB were lacking for the entire team, and that might be traced back to TLR if the reports are correct. Additionally, injuries to the hand/wrist areas are well known to sap power on contact, and he was clearly playing through an issue there for a while.

3) .315 career OBP combines the completely opposite players he’s been before and after the start of the 2019 season. Since 2019 he’s got a .347 mark, much more playable.

4) He was a undeniably a leader and emotional sparkplug for the team 2019-2021. That didn’t suddenly vanish. He wasn’t as expected this year, but I think it’s beyond ridiculous to go after players who are supposed to be leaders when everyone knows they had a manager who was completely checked out.

texag10

I’m always amazed when those posts pop up. “Player X is bad and not worth keeping but this highly successful organization will totally trade useful pieces to us for them.” If Tim is as mediocre as you claim, the Dodgers should have no problem finding a cheaper/better option than trading for Tim. If he’s a player that’s good enough for the Dodgers to actively pursue, why the hell are we getting rid of him since (for the time being) we are in the middle of a supposed contention window?

digger0910

Listen, a-t (and others). I think you all know that what we need here is a “T dubya t dubya” competition between Andrus, Anderson and Moncada. The top two get to stay!

/ducks

chambers.kevin

Mostly like Colson will be ready next year, or the following year. This organization and it’s loyalty is very bad. TA has already talked about free agency, and that he wants to get paid, so I’m not going to be surprised when the White Sox sign him to a 8 year 90 to 110 million extension that runs through his age 37 or something season.

charlie

Like I’ve been saying play Andrus at 3rd. Give him
a one year deal with club option for year two.

Amar

Has Jim Thome been linked before in the managerial search? Of all the insiders, he’s the only one where I’m like hell yeah. And not just because the Dugout would likely be resurrected :p

Last edited 2 months ago by Amar
ParisSox

I love Thome BUT I’d want to seriously know that he’d manage wisely using statistical reference in his decision making and not be old school just because “that’s the way we did it”.

I love Jim Thome and don’t want to hate Jim Thome.

ForsterFTOG

Thome is just Ventura with better career playing stats.

Amar

I actually dont think of Thome as old school, he belongs in his own school, but anyway this is all speculative.

Up2Drew

The love affair with Elvis Andrus is based on watching a decent veteran who plays hard and has a high baseball IQ contrasting so starkly with the existing roster. I enjoyed watching him, too. But he’s 34 and a below-average offensive player. It would not be money well-spent.

The answer isn’t signing Andrus for 2023 and beyond, it’s unloading guys on the roster who don’t contribute to winning play.

upnorthsox

Pretty much this.