Manny, manager's son cover for sleepy Sox

Perhaps White Sox hitters were more distracted by Manny Ramirez than we are, as they looked pretty flat in a 4-2 loss to Baltimore. Brian Matusz was pretty good, Sox hitters haven’t looked that bad in a while, and I’m willing to write it off as an off night.
Fortunately and unfortunately, there’s plenty else to write about. Following up on a couple of storylines from this week…
Manny Ramirez: Ramirez has been placed on waivers, the White Sox have claimed him, and Ramirez would approve a trade. So there are the essentials. Toni Ginnetti says the White Sox and Dodgers are doing groundwork for a trade, with the Dodgers are reviewing scouting reports on White Sox minor-leaguers. That doesn’t mean that the White Sox have the rights to a trade, as teams have until Friday to put a waiver claim in.
Forming a list of who I wouldn’t want to see dealt: Tyler Flowers, Brent Morel, Dayan Viciedo, Trayce Thompson, Miguel Gonzalez, Josh Phegley, Jose Martinez, Andre Rienzo. Beneath them, some of the names would hurt more than others, but it’s easy to overrate the relative-second-tier prospects in this bad of a system.
****************************
Oney Guillen: For the most part, I wouldn’t want to see Ozzie Guillen fired. I still think he’s a talented manager who can handle starters, and handling starters is the most important part of a manager’s job. Give him one more year, don’t let him handle important personnel decisions, and see how things shake out.
But whenever I see Oney Guillen’s name surface beyond my TweetDeck, I start to wonder if Joey Cora is ready to take over a club.
Since Oney tattled on Kenny Williams to sympathetic ear Joe Cowley, another fail whale of a conflict has spawned — except this one has insinuations of infidelity and deleted tweets! Awesome!
As it’s played out in the mainstream media: First, Cowley reported/opined that Williams had let down his team by laughing it up at a Carlos Mencia show instead of giving Ozzie Guillen a replacement pitcher. Williams told David Haugh that he asked Guillen and Don Cooper (a Williams puppet, according to Cowley) if more pitchers were needed, and they said “[coitus] no.”
For visual evidence, Williams showed NBC5’s Paula Faris phone records and text messages, which convinced Faris:

All the while, Oney took to Twitter to try to convince people that everything not said by Cowley was false, while Some highlights:

  • Everyone also thought that Tiger Woods was faitful (sic) to his wife and great human being. Don’t be so naive.
  • For the record no one has repramanded (sic) me of anything. Or ever will for that matter. Just hope and pray I that I (sic) don’t let the skeletons out of the closet.
  • when all the stories break later tonight or tomorow (sic) everyone will make me out to be a liar. When u (sic) and I both know I don’t lie about [dookers]

He may not “lie,” but he apparently he deletes tweets. A Twitter account created just to capture one — oney_lies — took a screenshot (and apparently ESPN1000’s “Waddle and Silvy” account saw it, too):

You know, it’s funny how the Internet brings the world closer and pushes people further apart, and it makes me wonder if the ambiguities and blurred lines that sa liaccccccca awfea 4at4 wgssssl;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
[aneurysm break]
This whole story is so stupid that I can see where Melissa Isaacson is coming from when she wonders if everybody’s in on the joke except us. I’d almost think there was something to this, especially since Cowley is on a warpath, carrying a torch for a guy who’s essentially indefensible in a wholly transparent unholy alliance.
But then I think of spring training and a couple grafs of a Mark Gonzalez story:

Then last week, Guillen revealed the Sox forbid him from developing his own Web page, which would focus on the Sox and Major League Baseball.
According to a source, that action cost the Guillen family several thousand dollars.

And that’s what I keep coming back to. I have no idea whether Kato Kaelin was the most adversely affected by that rejection, but it seems like money might be the cause of this kind of rift. And apparently it’s not going to end soon; he was born on third and thinks umpire’s discretion should’ve given him the last 90 feet, and he’s not being told otherwise:

“(But) Oney’s not part of this organization,” Guillen said Wednesday. “Oney says whatever he wants. The thing is, coming from him it looks bad.”
Some of his Tweets include comments about Sox general manager Ken Williams, but Guillen said his son is just a passionate fan who won’t get the manager in trouble.
“He didn’t put me in a bad situation; he put (himself) in a bad situation,” Guillen said. “What do you want me to say? I can’t say anything about it because I don’t know what he wrote.”

Mmm, that’s good enabling. My first thought was, “Aren’t children a reflection of their parents?” The lack of self-awareness in that quote answers that question, doesn’t it?
Anyway, I’m going to stop writing about this, because I’m guessing we’ll have to pick up the conversation again real soon. And now I’m imagining a regime in which we don’t have to talk about the manager’s son, and wondering if Williams and Jerry Reinsdorf are, too.

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jofpgallagher

I don’t get why the son of a manager gets so much attention. Frankly, I couldn’t care less what Oney Tweets. I am more concerned about Sox bullpen. I wonder if the sons and daughters, nephews and nieces,and grandfathers of others managers get this much attention. Stop highlighting about Oney’s tweets I would say….I mean, who cares? What has Oney done to be so important? Who is Oney besides being the son of a manager? Why do I need to read about his tweets in a Major League baseball team’s blog? Seriously.

fustercluck

The falsehoods are becoming egregious: “Oney Guillen declined comment.”

fustercluck

But it’s nice to see KW seems to be taking this latest farce in stride: “It’s been a long time since I’ve had to wait too long for a table, for instance, at a restaurant in Chicago. [And Market’s always hopping.]”

expatnyc

As I’ve said before, I think it’s time for Ozzie and the Sox to part company. I agree that he’s an above-average manager, mostly, but his seams are showing, and what’s underneath threatens the team. He’s immature. His family is too embedded in the organization (not entirely Ozzie’s fault)–and a couple of them are real assholes. He sometimes shows disastrously poor judgment–and a lack of imagination (running out Jackson only to get rained out). I don’t know what the fuck is going on in his confused head, but if this is about a few thousand dollars then I’d be happy to see him gone tomorrow. That kind of pettiness springs from a well of acid.

David

Oney’s tweets are a big problem because it’s pretty clear they are coming from Ozzie or conversations with Ozzie.
If your kid was publicly speaking bad about your boss would that be ok? I doubt it.

Doctor Memory

When evaluating the remarks of Ozzie, I ALWAYS take into account that English is a second language for him. His preferred methods of nuance are expletives, extraneous commentary, and inflammatory rhetorical questions. He understands major league baseball well, but his communications are – at minimum – as engaging for their sideshow features as for their baseball insights.
As you note, Jim, Ozzie’s expertise may or may not extend to competent parenting. (When a father is on the road more than half the days of his son’s childhood, how much consistency or emotional health can be expected in that dynamic?)
I rarely find myself in a position where I evaluate the remarks of Oney – short of casual dismissal. (This, just off the press, from our Understatement Department.)
So . . . evaluating Oney’s remarks: when I send or receive messages of the sort Oney sends, there seems to be a recurring theme of less-than-total sobriety. Just as some drunks get louder, I’ve noticed that intoxicated people have difficulty with spelling, continuity, and logic when they text. They are sometimes combative; they are sometimes self-inflating.
Is it fair of me to presume that his father’s ability to earn allowed Oney to attend above-average schools? Can I assume that Oney is of average intelligence? Do I err in believing that English is Oney’s first language? These are questions I need to answer before damning his immature, inflammatory, self-aggrandizing tweets.
Put another way: if Oney is taken just as his father suggests we take him – as a serious Sox fan, and nothing more – what conclusions might we draw?
Here are a couple I might draw: 1. Oney knows who the GM is; 2. Oney has some access to some of the players; 3. Oney is a self-important twit; 4. Oney may have a problem with drugs and/or alcohol; 5. Oney simplifies the operation of a major league baseball team in the ways of an outsider; 5. Oney has “daddy issues”. At a personal level, 6. Oney is a guy that I might have found interesting when I was 20, but one who would be a source of concern and some embarrassment, were he my son.

Doctor Memory

As you and others have noted, Jim, to have an immediate relative publicly denounce/criticize/impugn one’s employer is a matter of serious concern – especially for key employees.
So, it may be true that the Sox value the Ozzie brand – and that may override good manners and discretion about internal business matters.
It seems to me, though – as Striker mentions – when there are just 29 other potential employers in one’s area of highly-compensated expertise, the assessment of a candidate’s desirability MUST take into account behavior like Oney’s, and the prospective employee’s ability to manage his public-private life.
And since just one or two handfuls of those 29 would-be employers will be looking in the near-term to fill this specific position, I gotta agree with Striker.
Let’s allow that Ozzie is THE most “colorful” manager in the bigs today: is colorful really a key part of the job requirement? I see Ozzie as more suited to a position like Director of Minor League personnel, Chief Talent Evaluator of Minor League Personnel, Community Relations Lead Speaker, or the like.
Part of my bias is that I find Ozzie’s inflammatory style off-putting. Contrasted with – say – the equally bellicose Earl Weaver, Ozzie tends to speak out of turn about things not germane to his squad. If I wanted to use a pejorative, I’d say that Ozzie is a crackpot. He may amuse – and he may even provoke dialogue on topics grander than whether to hit-and-run, or which AAA guy might be best suited as a swing man for the stretch run – but, this sort of style of media interaction seems more suited for the lead dog of a team that isn’t fielding a competitive product.
(“Man, the Sox suck!”, Bob belches over the bar. “Yeah, but ol’ Ozzie’s always good for some crazy talk”, Karl answers, as he sets up another round of boilermakers for the regulars.)

Shinons

HAVE WE LEARNED NOTHING FROM PARIS AND NICOLE!!!????
🙁

knoxfire30

Its hard to think of a more spoiled brat then Oney Guillen he is disgracing his fathers name, haha.
I love the kenny showed a reporter text messages and log calls to shut that fucking liar oney up. Does anyone really think Kenny Williams wasnt available to make a call to AAA to bring a pitcher up? Come on…

striker

Do any of you think this affects Ozzie’s ability to land another managing job in the majors after he leaves the White Sox? If I were a GM I wouldn’t want the baggage that comes with Ozzie.

David

Thanks, Jim. I don’t have kids but if I did and they were publicly ripping my boss/employer I’d be sure to tell them to shut the eff up. The fact that Ozzie’s defense of Oney is saying he’s an adult, a citizen or whatever he said is an insult to KW and Jerry. KW’s uncommonly calm response to me was a “I only have to put up with this for another month” type of response.
Ozzie only redeeming quality at this point is how he handles a pitching staff. The daily lineup, in game offensive decisions and offensive baseball philosophy are poor and frankly don’t match with Kenny/Rick Hahn.
I don’t see why they’d retain Ozzie unless Jerry really thinks he is too strong of a brand and face of White Sox baseball to move on.

bigfun

He is a strong brand, but its bigger than marketing. Managers are usually only fired when things are going poorly. To can one while things are (superficially) going relatively well is very disconcerting to casual fans. I think Reinsdorf would need two years like 2007 or 3-4 like 2009 before he would square firing Ozzie with the fan reaction.
Managers are usually fired for things that largely aren’t under their control – a poorly constructed team performing poorly. They’re often retained for reasons equally removed from on-field performance.